Pete Zaitcev ([info]zaitcev) wrote,
@ 2008-05-14 00:11:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:fedora, linux

Rio and Upstart

Seen at Rio's place:

Fedora9のupstart、すごいんですけど...。さすがに組み込みみたいな速さでは無いけれど、これならサスペンドしなくても良いんじゃ...。

Which, in my very approximate translation means:

Upstart of Fedora 9 is great, mostly. As expected it includes no visible speed, so not using suspend is not good.

So, I guess that Rio expected improvements which would allow to stop suspending and they did not materialize... Which makes sense, but why the superlatives then? The title of the post was "upstartすげい!" with the exclamation mark. I would understand if he wrote that Upstart allowed him to end suspends, but no, "速さでない" is simple enough even for me to understand. Oh well, perils of international blogging.

Once I figured out that the control file syntax is documented in events(5) of all places, Upstart became rather tolerable, even welcome. I think that our famously poor bootstrap times (which are not that bad in Fedora when compared to other distros — I've seen real hard benchmarks — but are just bad for me as a user) have more to do with trying to execute too much crap. Upstart allows us to do it more efficiently, but it's a palliative.

UPDATE: piyokun comments that the right translation is more like "Of course it's not as fast as embedded (linux), but with (upstart) you can get by without suspending." So, the "shinakute" is like "doing", "mo" is change of state (he suspended before, but not anymore), "n" is explanation tag, and "ja" is uncertainty. Casual, of course. Oh, and "kumikomu" is a verb meaning "to incorporate". I had no idea that they had a native word for "embedded", instead of a katakanized borrowed word.



(Post a new comment)


[info]piyokun
2008-05-14 02:00 pm UTC (link)
I would translate the latter part:

Of course it's not as fast as embedded (linux), but with (upstart) you can get by without suspending.

In other words, Rio is praising the speed of upstart in its current condition.

I rarely comment here, but I'd like to take this opportunity to thank you for the interesting blog posts. Actually, I'd like to ask if you have an opinion on the Debian OpenSSL issue recently?

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]zaitcev
2008-05-14 05:33 pm UTC (link)
I'm not a security expert, sorry. I think I better refrain.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]anton_solovyev
2008-05-14 03:42 pm UTC (link)
Are you saying suspend actually works after all?!

Nah, I don't believe it -- it has never worked ever since Thinkpad T23 and Redhat 9. That was the last time. There's always something. Not to mention that X can't handle monitor change when you dock and undock anyway.

On the side note: SCO 5 had a thing when startup scripts executed in parallel, not sequentially in... somewhere around 1995. I have always wondered why neither Solaris nor Linux would do the same.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]zaitcev
2008-05-14 05:29 pm UTC (link)
Executing scripts in parallel is not as smart as it looks, unless the execution manager is smart enough to monitor load and avoid thrashing. Remember xtoolwait?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]anton_solovyev
2008-05-15 04:50 am UTC (link)
I am not familiar with xtoolwait, but that old SCO setup worked pretty well. I do not remember the details, but at least it prevented things like Oracle database hanging and stopping the the whole startup sequence.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]jgreely
2008-05-14 08:51 pm UTC (link)
"shinakutemo" is negative conditional te-form followed by mo for stress, meaning "even if doesn't do X". So, "With (Upstart), it's probably the case that even if (Fedora9) doesn't do suspend, it's good". I think. :-)

[-temo shows up a lot when asking for and giving permission, such as 吸ってもいいですか "is it okay if I smoke?"]

-j

(Reply to this)


Create an Account
Forgot your login?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…